First Pregnancy vs Second Pregnancy - Maternal Instincts, Preconception Care & Growing a Human

In this episode, we explore the journey from preconception through to pregnancy, motherhood and everything that changes along the way.

We talk about the importance of preconception care, including key nutrients, thyroid health, lifestyle factors and why preparing your body before conception can help support both mum and baby. We discuss how fertility and pregnancy health begin long before a positive pregnancy test and why understanding your body can be such an important part of the process.

Mo shares her experience of pregnancy and how different her second pregnancy has felt compared to her first. We chat about the physical realities of growing a human, navigating body changes, pregnancy symptoms and the unique challenges of being pregnant while already caring for a child.

We also discuss managing health concerns between pregnancies, including Mo's experience with pre-eclampsia during her first pregnancy and the proactive steps she has taken to support her health during her second. We explore the balance between being informed without becoming overwhelmed, advocating for yourself and navigating pregnancy after experiencing complications the first time around.

Along the way, we dive into maternal instincts, whether you can ever truly feel ready for a baby and the identity shifts that can begin long before birth. We discuss the importance of mental health during pregnancy, seeking support when needed and Mo's experience of working with a psychologist throughout pregnancy.

We also have an honest conversation about breastfeeding and how every mother's experience can be completely different. From expectations and challenges to the emotional side of feeding a baby, we reflect on the pressure many women feel and the importance of remembering that there is no one "right" way to navigate motherhood.

A conversation about preconception care, pregnancy, maternal instincts, breastfeeding, mental health, navigating previous pregnancy complications and the remarkable transformation that comes with bringing new life into the world.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Welcome to Mood Swings with Moen Morgs, where we chat all things womanhood, motherhood, and everything in between. We're a naturopath and a nurse who love an overchair, swapping insights and the occasional tangent.

SPEAKER_00 0:11

From hormones to healing and moments of chaos, nothing's off limits here.

SPEAKER_02 0:17

So let's get into it.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

Oh my god, I've got an itchy knee.

SPEAKER_02 0:28

An itchy knee? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 0:29

I got an itchy knee. Oh, so I don't know if you follow Fisher on Instagram. Do you follow him?

SPEAKER_02 0:37

Not really. I see when you like video. You know when you go on your reels, you can see your friends have laped things. I see whenever you've liked it, but that's all I ever say.

SPEAKER_00 0:44

So I don't know why when I said itchy knee, it just reminded me, but there's this video of him in Bali and he's like, um, itchy bum like Bali dog.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

And she's like, she like screeches over and you blacked that because I saw it just like screeching and bum on the ground. He's hilarious.

SPEAKER_00 1:03

Oh my god. I just he's a fucking he's honestly like I don't fangirl very much on many people, but love him and love Chloe. And I've met them maybe I've met them before and they're just such down to earth, like honestly, lovely people did. Are they from Papa Chillas?

SPEAKER_02 1:27

Gold Coast? Yeah, yeah, yeah. They sure are. I feel like everyone from Queensland is like quite down to earth and a bit more chilled. Yeah, well, I feel like we're known for that, yeah. Oh, we said that at the same time. That was you. That was cute. Oh my god. I thought I didn't turn on my fucking microphone. My heart just dropped into my vagina. Okay, we're good. I wonder how that would actually feel. Your heart dropping into your vagina. I feel it all the time. Like when I have like a like something anxiety happens and I feel it. Like I feel it.

unknown 2:01

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00 2:04

Pick my heart! So random. I'm gonna start off with my mood swing today. Okay. Is that alright? Yeah. Yeah, okay. My mood swing is it's pregnancy related. Well, that's on theme with today's podcast. Okay. It's on theme on brand. My belly is just so big. And I've actually because of having Lani and like carrying him, I think. Well, I asked one of the obstetricians because I was like, Dr. Blah blah blah. I know her. I was like, you wouldn't believe it, but on the weekend, I like turned and had this massive tear sensation on the inside of my tummy. I'm like, but um and I'm picking up my son and I'm you know like have I torn like a bit of my fascia? And he was like, it sounds like maybe you could have a little because where the pain is is like right next to my like it's where my belly button is, just slightly to the right. And he's like, you could have a little umbilical hernia. And I'm like, oh no. Anyways, it has been really sore.

SPEAKER_02 3:34

Can you explain to everyone what that is? Because I think a lot of people wouldn't know.

SPEAKER_00 3:38

Okay, so our umbilicus is our belly button, and a hernia essentially is like a little or it could be little big, whatever, but we have all of these different layers of our skin that hold us together, you know, so our internal organs are protected and don't explode out into the world.

SPEAKER_02 4:07

I love that it does that for us.

SPEAKER_00 4:10

It's pretty cool. But what can happen sometimes is from like big jolting movements or pressure is a little bit of the lining of the walls can break apart and then the softer layers of your skin can actually like come out.

SPEAKER_02 4:32

Interesting.

SPEAKER_00 4:33

Yeah. I imagine that feels very odd. So it can feel like a quite like a soft bulge, it can be in your it can you can have one in your where your belly button is, you can have one um in your groin. You can have them in several different locations. And generally speaking, they don't they like if they're small, they can go they can sort of come back in. Um but sometimes people need surgery for them. Yeah, and they can be quite painful. I think I remember now my dad had one. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:14

From lifting stuff. Like, do you get them from lifting things?

SPEAKER_00 5:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:17

Yeah. Yeah. Like especially like a trailer.

SPEAKER_00 5:18

So like the abdominal abdominal muscles may just like be quite weak, or you get it in a moment of weakness and it like breaks apart, and then yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:27

Could you get it done? Could you do it at the gym? Like if you're golly. So that's why you can't push it. Like you want to push it a little bit harder at the gym, but you don't want to push it too hard because you moral story you could end up with a few.

SPEAKER_00 5:37

Well, I mean, like it you you could be someone who pushes hard at the gym all the time and never get one, or you could be someone who just does one little push and boom, you've got one.

SPEAKER_02 5:50

Boom, you've got a hernia. So hernia equals not fun time.

SPEAKER_00 5:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:54

Oh huh. So have we got confirmation or no, it's just suspection.

SPEAKER_00 5:59

Yeah. I mean, I haven't gone and actually gotten it checked. I've just asked one of the doctors over there. Still feels yeah. I'm seeing my obstetricians on Monday, so I'll mention it to them then. They might just want to do like a check something. But they can't really do anything anyways because of where it is. I would have to have if I had to have surgery for it, it would be after I have baby. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:26

But just still what, like 20 weeks away? A bit less.

SPEAKER_00 6:31

Yeah, well, hopefully I don't go to term.

SPEAKER_02 6:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:34

Like I don't want to go, like I don't want to be 40 weeks.

SPEAKER_02 6:37

Oh, okay, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:39

In a perfect world, like 38, 37.

SPEAKER_02 6:43

I have questions for you, but I'll wait until we get into the podcast. I was about to hammer you with them then, but I was like, Yeah, well, you can hammer me, but before you hammer me.

SPEAKER_00 6:50

Ding ding ding ding ding ding. Ding ding ding. Um tell me your moody swing. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:58

Um, I think let's keep on the theme of pregnancy for you. No, I'm not pregnant. I'm not pregnant. Not that I know of. I haven't had a pregnant.

SPEAKER_01 7:08

I haven't had a spectacle.

SPEAKER_02 7:09

No baby. No, no, no, no. I'm about to come out period. I'm not pregnant. Um, but with all the little babies around me, I think I've said this before. I'm not sure if I want children or not. It's definitely not like uh ultimate goal of mine. But they're massaging my toes, they're so sweet. They're probably a bit smelly.

SPEAKER_01 7:33

I can't smell them. I'm not sniffing them, I'm just rubbing them. You know what? Yeah, you said your smell gets really hot. Yeah. True, true. Well, I can't smell them, so that's a good sign. Oh god.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

Um but with all the little babies around me at the moment, am I ready now to have a baby? Absolutely not. I will not lie. Like when I think of me having a child, I'm like, uh my whole body clenches up and I'm like not ready.

SPEAKER_00 8:01

I just honestly, I just don't think anyone is actually ready. I love that you say that because when I Like doesn't matter how much prep work you do.

SPEAKER_02 8:09

Yeah, you never fully. I like that you said that because I don't think I'll ever fully be there. Because obviously, before pregnancy, not to go on a tangent, but like you value freedom a lot, and then obviously having a child that's completely removed from you forever. So, like, that terrifies me, I will admit, but not the moral of the story. Now that I see all of these babies around me, and all these babies keep coming into work, and I'm like, holy fucking shit, every time they come in, my eyes start watering, like they actually start watering, and I'm like, okay, that's obviously my body telling me something that okay, maybe you do want a child in this life.

SPEAKER_00 8:46

I was literally talking to one of the girls at work about this just the other day because she her and her her husband were like, we don't want kids, blah blah blah. And then she said, Oh my god, I can't help it. Every time I see a baby being born, because she we were in obstetrics that day, she's just like I just can't get that thought out of my mind. Yeah, like I'm like, maybe I do want this. Yeah, something else. But I think it's our maternal kicking in.

SPEAKER_02 9:17

Yes, because it's like, come on, honey, you're about to turn 30, like at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_00 9:22

If we talk about Stone Ages and like if we take away the modern world and we we really, really bring it back, yeah. You know, like our bodies were made to house babies and 100%.

SPEAKER_02 9:37

There's a reason why we have a period every or ovulate and have a period every month.

SPEAKER_00 9:41

So I think I think it's a very natural response to feel like emotional and see babies and feel like a sense of like, oh my god, I could do this, I do want this. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:50

But then you sort of remember. But but then I think about the reality, and I was like, fuck no, like I think absolutely not.

SPEAKER_00 9:57

Can I say I think that is because we've you know, for the only way I can sort of like break it down and m make it make sense to me and hopefully make it make sense to everyone else, is like people see Lani's feet, for example, and when he's in his boots and bars and they're like, Oh, does it bother him? And I'm like, no, because that's always known.

SPEAKER_02 10:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:23

But for us, we've grown up in a world where we can be selfish, yeah, where we can have freedom, yeah. So we know what that feels like. Yeah. Whereas I think if we didn't know what the ability of freedom and like not having to like worry about other people, then we would be, yeah, a bit of a different mindset when it comes to childbearing and right 100%.

SPEAKER_02 10:54

And you don't know what you don't know, like you're coming to me on with this information, like you do know, but I'm hearing it. But like I will never be able to hear really what you're saying until I've been on the other side. Yeah. Because I have no concept of what it's like.

SPEAKER_00 11:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:09

Anywho, being an atropath and you know, doing all the things that I recommend for clients, I was like, I know me when I want something, it will happen instantaneously, and I'll be like, I want it, and I want it in the next few months. I've always had a problem with my iron. I've been a vegetarian for a lot of my life. I've always had a problem with my thyroid, and I was like, that's something I've been working on just for my general health for the last few years.

SPEAKER_00 11:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:35

However, I've had a little bit of a boot up the bum recently because I've seen so many of my preconceptional a boot up the bum. Yeah, had a boot up the bum.

SPEAKER_01 11:48

Sorry when you said that. I was just like I thought I was saying in my head, but I think I whispered it. And then I said it. We've done that.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

Um, like I know how important thyroid function is for pregnancy. I know how important fucking iron is for pregnancy. And I'm going to be honest. Last time I got my ferritin tested, it was undetectable. Which anyone that knows anything about ferritin and ferritin is is like your iron stores. So for it to be non-detectable, I'm not gonna lie, if I saw a client come in with those blood results, I would say to them, um, are you okay? Like, how are you functioning a normal life? I felt fine, but maybe it's just how I've always navigated my life because I've been iron deficient probably my whole life. Anywho, I've been really working on it, more with the goal of like, if I ever want to fall pregnant, I want to make sure I'm on top of all of this before I start looking at having a child. I went to the doctor yesterday to get like my blood results after maybe about six months, and I've been so consistent with my treatment plan, but I was so nervous because I was like, great, they've called me in, like, they need to say something, blah blah blah. Long behold, my thyroid is back in range. They tested my antibodies. My antibodies are only at like 10. They were in the hundreds when I first got diagnosed, so happy days there. And um, my iron, my ferritin, it's still low, but it's like slowly tracking up. So, like, yay! It's all positive signs, all positive signs, and it really just reaffirmed to me that when you're consistent with these things, like and you see the difference on the blood test, it's so motivating because you're like, oh my god, what I'm doing is actually working. Um, so yeah, that's my mood swing for the week. The positive of sticking to my treatment plan that I made for myself and seeing the results in the blood, and like being able to reaffirm, like, okay, this is trusting the process, trusting the process, and you're getting the results. And I do want to highlight that I know that it's nerve-wracking, like I was so nervous to go and get those results, like because I was scared they were gonna tell me things had gotten worse or whatever. So, like, it's very normal to feel anxious when you like go and get those results, and like it's very easy to put it off, put it off, put it off. But at the end of the day, this is your health, and it it it needs to be the priority. Advice I'm giving to myself as well.

SPEAKER_00 14:16

Yeah, yeah, that's advice to yourself, but also also everyone else, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:21

Because I know I work with freaking women every day and I tell them to go do the blood test and they don't message me for another eight weeks, but I'm that person as well. Like it's it it's a universal thing, and I think a lot of it is kind of nerve-wracking because you're scared what's gonna come back. Yeah, but we have to like not look at it in that way.

SPEAKER_00 14:39

I think I think yeah, you you touch on that really well. Like, you shouldn't we shouldn't be afraid of finding out the results, whether it's a uh not a great outcome or it's a great outcome. Because finding out results allows us to formulate the right plan.

SPEAKER_02 14:57

Exactly, and to solve it.

SPEAKER_00 14:59

You're not going to get better if you're unwell by avoiding it.

SPEAKER_02 15:04

No, you probably will get worse.

SPEAKER_00 15:06

I do not, I'm such a promoter of I d you you just have to face it at what it is. Yeah. You know, you deal with it at what it is.

SPEAKER_03 15:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:19

And everything will be alright in the end. You deal with the whitewash, you go through it, you get you get there and you go, okay. That's not as great as we were hoping it would be, or you know, we found out a result that really affects us or really affects m you know how I'm feeling. But what are the steps I can take to change that?

SPEAKER_02 15:43

Yeah, yeah. Be proactive in our health. And I think being women, it makes it sometimes easier to know that for me this the motivating factor was the potential to have a child one day. Like once you have a child, the motivating factor is to feel good for your children. Yeah, but there's almost something else pushing you forward, which is there is more motivators and I like that. Sometimes I feel like I need to be stepping outside of myself to motivate myself, yeah. And we're so good at doing that as women, so yeah. Love it. Wow, love a cheeky blood test.

SPEAKER_00 16:17

Blood tests are really good, and I think it's very important um that people get blood tests regularly, even if your blood work is always good, and you know, like there was nothing wrong, but you're you're coming to that time where you know it probably isn't a bad idea to get your blood checked again, you should do it because things happen, your body changes, like like you're saying, your ferritin was so so extremely low, and now it's increased. How are you ever to know that result if you didn't continue to get the blood work? Exactly. And how are you supposed to know? How are you supposed to formulate your future plan if you don't know the result?

SPEAKER_02 16:59

And like it's such a good example because I did pivot like when I first was working on my iron, I actually started taking like beef organ capsules, like hoping that they would be sufficient enough to like boost my iron, because I have heard from other naturopaths that that's what worked for them. Yeah. Boosting their own personal ferritin. That didn't work for me. Like I was nil. Not to say it doesn't work, but it didn't work for me.

SPEAKER_00 17:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:22

It wasn't until I started taking like a really good you know, practitioner grade iron supplement every second day that I started to see an increase. So like again, I wouldn't have known to pivot even without seeing those results. Yeah. Um, so yeah, very important. I'm a big anyone that comes and sees me knows that I'm an advocate for blood testing because I'll send you away with a lot of blood tests to get.

SPEAKER_00 17:47

I am one of those and I think this is why I've I've I love looking at my blood results. I'm obsessed with them. I love reading on the parameters and like the results of them, even though you know the doctor interpreter and tells you exactly like what's happening. I like to deep dive into them.

SPEAKER_02 18:06

Oh, I deep dive to a new degree. Like even if the doctor told you you're fine, I can promise you will come to me and I will find something. I promise you I will be like actually Actually, you're not fine. Which I think in one sense is quite validating for people because I think if they've been going through enough of a health thing to go to the doctor and then say that oh it's all fine, and they sometimes leave and they feel a bit dismissed.

SPEAKER_00 18:32

The thing is with the doctors and with um you know Western medicine is that the parameters for our blood work is is an average of what is currently like the normal ranges for people. Yeah. So even though, say for example, ferritin, like we'll just go on that because that's a really easy one to work with. Like ferritin is between like 10 and 30. 30.

SPEAKER_02 19:08

The the reference range should be no lower than 30 at the doctor.

SPEAKER_00 19:15

If all of these people are getting blood work and they're seeing that the average range is actually like 45, that parameter changes from 20 to 30 to 30 to 40. Yeah. So that it so it sort of goes with what is the the most average ranges.

SPEAKER_02 19:45

Yeah, and that's why as now to pass we don't use those reference ranges, we just use our own.

SPEAKER_00 19:51

So you could be fine in in a in a averaged way, but you actually if you if you look at it in the finer detail, which is what you guys do.

SPEAKER_02 20:06

And to be honest, now with the internet, you probably have access to functional ranges at I don't know how accurate the sites are because I've never done it, but like you would probably be able to find some good information out there as well. Like, for instance, using ferritin again, and then we'll leave this topic. They won't flag it unless it's under 30. I want it like at 100. Yeah. So it's usually quite a significant change. Yeah, yeah. So obviously, we're always looking at optimal, like just moving towards that as a target, not just like if you're not that you're unhealthy. Yeah. But yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:45

You're unhealthy, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:46

You're unhealthy and you're not gonna feel good. Like, no, never. We're just looking at like how can we optimize everything for you? Yeah, but yeah, I think the blood that's a good point, like how they average it out, and that's why they can change, and that's why, even like um, you could go to different um blood testing companies, and they'll have different reference ranges for different the exact same test. Yeah, and it's like that's where it can get quite confusing for people. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:12

And if you don't understand that world, um the numbers can mean absolutely nothing to you.

SPEAKER_02 21:19

Oh, I remember when I first got my blood test done like back in the day, and I looked at it and I'm like, how the fuck are they reading this? Yeah. Like, what the actual is going on? Like it's crazy. Um, but yeah, such a useful tool for us, and we live in such a like we're actually really lucky the country living, like so much is covered by Medicare, so we're so lucky. So much. We're so lucky. But yeah, that's my movie swing for the week. Perfect. Anywho, today we uh well, I really wanted to talk on this conversation with Mo because, as you all know, she is um on her second pregnancy at the moment.

SPEAKER_00 21:57

Pregnante.

SPEAKER_02 21:59

Pregnante. Um, and I really just wanted to explore with you kind of the difference between the two pregnancies, how you're finding this pregnancy, what like kind of any detail you want to go into. I want to know like the good, the bad, everything. Um, I yeah, really would love for you to get into every aspect of it. So we can dive in.

SPEAKER_00 22:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:27

Obviously, only what you feel comfortable sharing, which I know for you probably everything. I'm happy to share everything with with everyone. Um, but I think that that will be super important. One, I'm being selfish, I want to know because I love to hear the stories like for like my own experience one day. But also, I just think it's really relatable either to mums that have been through it, going through it, want to go through it. Yeah, definitely talk about it because I don't think it's talked about that much.

SPEAKER_00 22:57

Well, I think you know, if you have your first pregnancy and then if you have another pregnancy, um you obviously will always sort of compare yourself to the first one. You don't mean to, but it's just naturally what we do. We because we've experienced it, gone through it. So we I feel like for this pregnancy, I'm always sort of looking back at like how I felt with Ronnie, and it is very different. I think we I never had the expectation of it being exactly like copycut paste sort of situation. Um but so different in so many ways. I think because I've had my babies quite close together, like when this one comes to the world, they will be 20 months apart from Lani and this baby.

SPEAKER_02 23:53

Is that what you're calculating just in your head?

unknown 23:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

You're on your own client for a second.

SPEAKER_00 23:57

Yeah. Um so yeah, two under two, which is you know, it's a lot. But your body hasn't even like my body was still going through like the postpartum healing phase. So I've gone from being pregnant for the first time, my body experiencing it, all of the things for the first time, you know, the stretching, the the hormone shifts, the the uterus rolling, all of that sort of stuff learning the first time. So everything is just so different, and you don't have to worry so much about a little humid as well. So I think what I took for granted back then, because I I mean you don't know any different this time around, I was I've I've reflected, I'm like, I'm so grateful that I got to experience that because this time it's just like it's not the way at all.

SPEAKER_01 25:00

There ain't much time to be slow.

SPEAKER_00 25:03

No time to be slow, like when you want to rest. Well, you just can't with a toddler, but when I was resting with Lani, when I was pregnant with him, you were like uninterrupted. It felt like a spa day. Yeah. It's like I felt like, okay, amazing. I got to sleep, I got to watch movies, I got to like put my little pillow under my my belly so that it was supported and that my round ligaments weren't sore. Now I'm fighting my son in the bed because he wants to sleep with us because he's had a bad dream or something, and my tummy is in the way, but he's like, I want to be close to you, and so I think those things, you know, comparing those, it's just a little bit different in that aspect because you don't have um as much freedom. Did she just put some water in your nose? Sorry. No, you don't be sorry. Does your nose feel fresh now?

SPEAKER_01 26:05

Yeah, hydrated. I've snotted today. I've snorted fucking water.

SPEAKER_00 26:11

Well, it's all good in the hood. I don't mind. The nose is just doing all the things today. Next you'll be rubbing your snot on my on my shoulder. But um, yeah, you get so much freedom in your first pregnancy, and it's actually like such a beautiful like evolution and experience, and blah blah blah. But the second one, you it's still really beautiful, but I just think you just don't have time to sit and think about it, really. Like these last 21 weeks have just flown by for me, but in the same sense, has been really quite different. I mean, it obviously very well documented across all areas, but like my postpartum period, I suffered from a really bad postpartum anxiety and probably a little bit of a depression in there, to be honest. And then going from that straight into being pregnant again, you know, the shift in hormones a lot, and this time around, I'm actually seeing a psychologist, um, maternal psychologist, um, and psychiatrist as well, because I don't know, I think I think I'd come out of one thing and I've gone into another completely, and I know that I'm I'm better for it this time around because I sort of am expecting what I went through, but I also think that that is some in some way, shape, or form a little bit like anxiety driving because I'm like, oh my god, I don't want to go through those feelings again of like not being able to sleep for literally four nights for the first four nights of the baby's life.

SPEAKER_02 28:01

Like that, because you were so scared.

SPEAKER_00 28:04

I was just so anxious, yeah. I I was like, oh my god, my baby's gonna stop breathing. Like even though I'm working healthcare, I think when it is specifically related to you, or when it's something personal, it's completely different. You sort of lose all of that. Like, you know, judgment and expectation.

SPEAKER_02 28:27

Yeah, sometimes you've been exposed to almost too much that there's no logic, and you're just flashing through every possible scenario because you've seen every possible scenario.

SPEAKER_00 28:36

I think it's a double-edged sword, like it's so good to know the knowledge I know, but also it it it it is like we do see some really crazy things and hear some really crazy things, and that sort of does put a lot of you become really, really hyper-vigilant in in in everything. And I think as a result, that's sort of made me a little bit more I'm not I'm not depressed, I just am very and I'm not anxious, I just think I'm very emotional right now. So like things, even if it's a bit it's positive stuff, exciting things, like I'm so excited to have another baby. But I just can't, like sometimes I'll just like uncontrollably cry. Like I'll be like, oh my god, what what the fuck? Like I'm so privileged for the life that I get to live and the the family that I'm creating, but it is hard, it is hard work, and your mind as a mother really doesn't ever shut off. And like this pregnancy, I've really had to I haven't actually had a moment to like appreciate it, if that makes sense, because you know like Lani's at such a stage in his um like toddler life where he's super super like curious and inquisitive. He wants to like get amongst stuff and be there, do that, touch this, and you're just running after your little human, and you also are in this really like weird limbo phase, like you it's gonna get me emotional now, but like you're like, oh my god, I wanna enjoy every moment I have with you before like the next baby comes along. Yeah, when your undivided attention can't be on him anymore, yeah. And so you're sort of in this like weird state of like I wanna be there for your firstborn, but you're also like I wanna honour my body and what it's growing. But you're in this really weird phase, it's just it's different. The second pregnancy is different. Is it beautiful? Oh my god, it's so beautiful. I'm so so I like find myself going through like moments of like pure joy and happiness and just like gratefulness that I end up doing this, like crying. Like, oh my god, I'm so lucky. But also I'm like, ah, what the fuck? Like, how am I gonna do two? I can't even I can hardly even do one. Like I don't know the rule book. Yeah, like no one does.

SPEAKER_02 31:37

That's and there is no rule book, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:40

It's um yes, a different journey, and I've my pregnancy symptoms have been way different this time. Like I was sick with Lani and I was like vomiting and nauseas, but only till about like 13, 14 weeks. This pregnancy I have a severe like almost every day I'm vomiting in my mouth just constantly. Like I've got severe reflux. I have to take a meprazole for that, um, which I take every day. Do you find that helps? No, I still well it helps, but I still I'm still you know like bringing it up. Not as much, but yeah, and then this pregnancy as well from my last pregnancy, because I got gestational hypertension, I have to take aspirin uh as well because it's to try and reduce the risk of me getting preeclampsia for this pregnancy. Um, so just like a few more things that I have to manage uh that I didn't have to, well, I didn't have to until the very end, or you know, only in the beginning, uh, with Lani. So it's a journey. It's one of those things that like you love, but you're also like I can't wait for this part to be over. Yeah. I don't blame you. And I'm someone who carries I'm a really big b I'm a really big pregnant lady. When I mean big, like my stomach is just so obviously round. Yeah. And I because I think I'm not like a huge girl, I'm quite small. Your petite. I'm short, but like also I'm s I'm sort of like I'm short and thick. So when I there's nothing else to go out, it's just like this way.

SPEAKER_02 33:52

But it's a beautiful belly, as much as I'm trying to. It's a beautiful belly, giving you a bit of discomfort.

SPEAKER_00 33:57

It's so discomforting. I'm actually having some really bad round ligament pain at the moment, which is only gonna get worse as I get bigger. But it's not expected, it's not unexpected for me because I knew that that would happen. Because last time I was seeing my physio from literally eight or nine weeks, because I had really bad sciatica on my left side until lit like literally birth. Like seeing my physio the whole time because I'm because of the work that I do and when you are pregnant your body's body relaxes. You all of the you just start to discover all of these like joints and ligaments and that you've never noticed before. How did I how did I not know what that pain felt like until now? So yeah, it's just one of those things, I guess. But I knew that I would get round ligament pain because I just am big, but I'm very lucky I don't have any like um what are these called stretch marks.

SPEAKER_02 35:18

Yeah, I was like, I don't know. So I just keep putting stuff on your belly.

SPEAKER_00 35:22

Yes. Yes, like tallow or I do, so this is my raging. Yeah, go. Because I used to in my first pregnancy I used Pure Mama, and oh my god, it is like liquid gold, it's so good. Um, loved that stuff. I put it on day, night, it maybe even during the d like during the day when I wanted to if my skin felt dry. This pregnancy I've gone through a different approach. Not because I don't love um pure mama, but just because I don't know, my skin's really already quite soft in that space, so I don't I I don't know. I I wanted something a little bit like more heavier on my skin. So I at night time I actually put the tutorfare um the holy grail.

SPEAKER_02 36:18

Yeah, I think that's what I would use.

SPEAKER_00 36:20

So I I and I put a lot on. Yeah, because it layer that bad boy up, and my skin feels so good and silky smooth on my tummy and my boobs. And then I also put on my um mamabe oil, baby oil. Oh mama oil, sorry, not baby oil, and I put that on during the day as well. Uh-huh. That's beautiful. So you this area is very nourished. Very nourishment. On the sides of my tummy and in my on my breast, because like for all the mummas out there who know, like your boobs just pop skyrocket.

SPEAKER_02 37:02

Yeah. That's like I I think I I would love that. Or am I being naive?

SPEAKER_00 37:07

No, well, I love it, but I also I took a photo of like my boobs when I loved them the most, and it's in my hidden photos. Because that's like I said to Cameron, that's my goal of what I want them to look like after I've had kids.

SPEAKER_03 37:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:26

So I'm just gonna take that to a doctor and say, fix me up, let's do it like this. But um, they're really, really nice and they're like huge because they're full of milk and they're producing um nutrients for your baby, but as soon as the as soon as the milk's gone, you know, they turn into saggy boobs.

SPEAKER_02 37:51

Yeah, I didn't even think of that. And especially because you're a small boob girl too, weren't you?

SPEAKER_00 37:55

Yes. Yeah. So I've actually stretched and I've got stretch marks in my boobs.

SPEAKER_02 38:02

Yeah. I think I would definitely as well, because I even got stretch marks going through puberty.

SPEAKER_00 38:07

And I used to TMI, but you know, that's a little TMI bounty up. I used to have a five cent nipple.

SPEAKER_02 38:14

What oh like a little one.

SPEAKER_00 38:16

I used to have like my areola and my nipple would fill a five cent piece.

SPEAKER_02 38:22

Oh, that's quite small, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 38:23

Now, not so much.

SPEAKER_02 38:25

Oh, so they've stretched out, but then they don't go back.

SPEAKER_00 38:28

No, these well. Oh yeah, but that's what my boob looks like. Like a 50 cent um.

SPEAKER_02 38:34

That's well, that's what mine looks like naturally, so I don't know what to know what they did in my boob. You're rich.

SPEAKER_00 38:45

So yeah, so that or you know, all of the changes that come with that, and my nipples are so weathered.

SPEAKER_02 38:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:53

Because, you know, little babies sucking away on them. But it's so weird. I I don't know what it is, and I think it just goes to show like the human body is amazing. I honestly loved the idea of breastfeeding Lani. Like, I was like, I'm you know, I'm a mum, like this is my calling, like this is what you do, you nurture your baby. Now he grabs my boobs, and I'm like, I could not think of anything worse than having you like on the T run. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:26

But for this new one, you're like, yeah, you've seen it.

SPEAKER_00 39:29

I'm like that's what they're there for.

SPEAKER_02 39:32

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:34

It's like we go through this like phase when we need to like provide nutrients and and nourishment to our child that it's like it's okay, but you know, after I'm just like, oh yeah, done.

SPEAKER_02 39:50

Yeah, it's like your body knows it's like no no no, this is for new bubba now.

SPEAKER_00 39:54

Yeah, yeah. And I reckon after newbaba has the milky milks from these boobs and goes no more, I'm I'm gonna feel the same way.

SPEAKER_02 40:04

Yeah, you're gonna be done. Yeah, like that icky feeling. Yeah. It's a mumbo.

SPEAKER_00 40:12

I just no.

SPEAKER_02 40:14

You can tease. That's that terrifies me. Like I've always breastfeeding. I hope that it's something. If I ever have children, it's something I can do.

SPEAKER_00 40:24

I had to stop at seven months. And was that when the teeth had to come through? Oh my god, Lani. Lani's been a really, really early teever. Like, I think his first two teeth, his first two teeth came at four months. Yeah. But he's got a full set in there. Oh, and like that, like clamping onto your nipple, my babe, he would bite down and and pull back.

SPEAKER_02 40:46

So they were bleeding all the time.

SPEAKER_00 40:48

They would bleed, they would they would feel like they were going like through two pieces of sandpaper. No. It was horrible.

SPEAKER_02 40:56

Good on anyone, like, look, I know for the health, I know breastfeeding for as long as possible is great, but as soon as it was teeth involved for me personally, I don't think I could carry on.

SPEAKER_00 41:05

No, no, I I and I think a lot of women put so much pressure on themselves when it comes to breastfeeding, and this is something that I will never ever ever like push my agenda on for other women. No way. Because breastfeeding is so so personal. Yeah, there are so many factors that can impact the ability to breastfeed. Yeah. Like your nipple size. Do you have inverted nipples? The latch. Is your milk supply good? Yeah. Is it mastitis? Do you have oversupply, undersupply? Yeah. Does baby latch? Like, yeah, if you try and it's too much for you, fuck yeah, babe. You do try to do that.

SPEAKER_02 41:58

If you tried, yeah. Like a well, even if you don't feel like you can try, like, that's also enough. There is a lot of yeah, there's a lot of judgment, I think.

SPEAKER_00 42:07

I think because in a perfect world breast is advocated as best. Yeah. And yes, absolutely. There are studies to show that the amount of nutrients and um good antibodies that your baby gets from your milk uh is so vital in that first year. But some mums don't have that privilege of doing that. Oh, it's fun if you don't have a milk. And it's also a massive, massive head fuck. Yeah.

unknown 42:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:44

It is a massive head fuck because you're looking at your baby, right? You're feeding for the first time, you're not really sure if they're getting enough supply. Yeah, like how can you measure it? Can go off is whether or not that baby is thriving. Yeah. And the way that they uh assess that is if they're gaining weight. Yeah. Um, and a few other things, but mainly weight. So for you, when you're looking at a bottle and it says give 150 mils, but then you're breastfeeding, you're like, am I feeding them 150 mils? Yeah, or am I feeding them 10 mils? Like, you can't measure your output. And I think the biggest thing that happens for women is it can become a bit of a control thing. Like women are like, well, am I giving them enough? But your baby will tell you and give you those cues and signs to say when they've had enough. But that sometimes for someone who likes to be in control or likes to see the metric. Of the the or the volume of what they're giving, it can be a really really really big time.

SPEAKER_02 44:07

I would struggle with that big time. I know for a fact.

SPEAKER_00 44:11

And then it can be the other way around. You're like, are you giving too much? For me, I had an oversupply.

SPEAKER_02 44:17

Can you can you overfeed them at that age? Um or they just kind of stop and like kind of start vomiting it up a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 44:25

If you're overfeeding, they will end up like usually they will do have have like a little trucker.

SPEAKER_03 44:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:34

Or um yeah. I I don't really know too much detail on that. Maybe I can get one of my midwife friends to come on and we can have a chat. Dive into that.

SPEAKER_02 44:47

Yeah, I would love to.

SPEAKER_00 44:48

But yeah, it's one of those things, like for me, I had an oversupply. I was literally from each breast in the first 24 hours pumping like 60 mils. And then I remember in the space of five minutes, and I wasn't even doing much. I just like had an abundance, which yes is amazing, but also caused me strife for the first three weeks because I was so engorged, and because you're engorged, it changes the nipple shape, the breast shape, and so then baby can have difficulty latching. There's all these things you don't think about. Yeah, like I've never I've never thought about that in my entire life. But then that can affect how they feed, and then they can become fussy, and then it's just all this domino effect. So it's wild, but um essentially with that you just have to be mindful.

SPEAKER_02 45:55

I don't know, I've just no, I don't know, you haven't, and I like the way I kind of want to wrap up that is your breastfeeding journey is your own, and please don't compare it to other people.

SPEAKER_00 46:08

Yeah, same as your pregnancy journey.

SPEAKER_02 46:10

Yeah, it is your journey, easier said than done, obviously, especially when you've probably got older fucking relatives being like, you should do it like this, you should do it like this.

SPEAKER_00 46:19

Oh my god, you're always have people do that. Shut the fuck up. You'll always do and do you know what? I I still to this day have people do that. I think it because at my workplace we obviously deal with lots of obstetrics. So seeing all of those women come in and and the midwives like being there for so long, they always have their two cents, and I just think, yeah, yeah, okay, okay, okay. I'm just gonna nod and wave, like no worries. But again, hyper vigilant, we all are, and like everyone has the best interests for you, but they'll be like, I remember at the end of my pregnancy with Lani, they were like, Oh my god, you're really puffy. Like, um, how's your how like how's your blood pressure? Like, they were thinking pre-eclampsia, and so and then I ended up getting gestational hypertension, so it's it's good, like they see the signs, but I'm also like, I'm just puffy because there's nothing I can do, so I'm not me broke.

SPEAKER_01 47:22

Yeah, like I'm growing a fucking human.

SPEAKER_00 47:24

Yeah, like leave me alone. Leave me alone, I'm gonna go to bed. And I've I'm feeling that again, like people going, oh my god, wow, you're so big already. I didn't want to say anything. And I was like, Well, yeah, sorta did.

SPEAKER_01 47:38

You just did.

SPEAKER_00 47:40

Sorry, to hate to break it to you, but you shouldn't be able to do that. I'm like, I'm allowed to say it. But you just keep it out. Yeah, zone but pregnancy is yeah, crazy. But I'm excited these next few weeks. I've I don't know why. I have this crazy, crazy feeling I'm gonna have my baby early. I don't know why, because I just mother's intuition, maybe. Well, yeah, I don't know. I think because I just feel like my body is not settling down. And and last time my obstetrician said to me, You really need to slow it down. And actually made me go on maternity a little bit earlier because I was having really bad tightenings and Braxton Hicks, and in my workplace, we do have like it's busy, and when we have emergencies come in, you're running around like you it's it's all go. And so I was like, Oh, that's what I was like then. I wonder what it's gonna be like this time around. So, watch this space, we'll see. We'll see what um what what date we go with.

SPEAKER_02 49:01

What little Civy wants to do.

SPEAKER_00 49:03

But Sibi is due on the 30th of September, 30th September, a little Libra, which will be beautiful, which is so crazy. We're gonna end on this. Yeah, because Cameron, yes, my husband, is an aquarium, and my son Lani is an aquarium.

SPEAKER_03 49:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 49:24

And now, baby number two is a Libra. I'm a Libra! That's so beautiful. You d I said I manifest I'm sorry, but I did manifest this, and I said to Cameron.

SPEAKER_01 49:39

Your manifestation is real!

SPEAKER_00 49:40

It is real, it's real and I said to Cameron, oh my god. When I've when I had Lani, like I think the day after I had Lani, I said to Cam, wouldn't it just be the best thing if we have another baby? Yes, and it's a Libra magic, and he was like, Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:59

Now, yeah, yeah, suck it in, Uzzle.

SPEAKER_00 50:06

So how cool.

SPEAKER_02 50:08

Oh well, thank you for sharing all that. That was very insightful and I feel like sometimes I ramble. No, I love hearing everything because yeah, like we spoke about at the start, like until you've been through it, it's like hard to comprehend, but I like to have some form of comprehension in my brain anyway. Some form. It's just yeah, it's informative. It's nice to hear about it, and yeah, I think it's important for them all the mamas out there.

SPEAKER_00 50:38

Thanks for listening to my pregnancy trouts. Always. Always.

SPEAKER_02 50:44

Always here. I want to hear it all.

SPEAKER_00 50:45

Ears are here, eyes are there.

SPEAKER_02 50:47

We can make every episode about your pregnancy until you give birth.

SPEAKER_00 50:52

I would I'd be like, oh, this chick's just self-obsessed, right?

SPEAKER_02 50:58

No. Are you kidding? You're like doing the most sometimes when I like not sometimes, all the time when I think about pregnancy, like when I actually think about little spermy swimming to egg, and then all of a sudden creates a baby, and then this baby turns into a human. I'm like, what's the actual fuck?

SPEAKER_00 51:16

I know it's so mind blowing. What the actual fuck? You're like, you're like yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:23

Let's like call. I'll spar. I'm already sparling, so let's cut it there.

SPEAKER_02 51:30

Alright, guys, we love you, and we will see you next week for another episode. Bye. Bye.